The company has also just revealed the A10-7890K APU, which offers a small speed increase over the current flagship APU from AMD, the A10-7870K. http://aimsely.com
Depends. The binning process often makes it more likely to get better results out of a chip that is clocked higher from the factory while sticking to the same voltage/TDP. Though market demand doesn't always match bin results and that's part why that doesn't always hold true. Long story short yes and no, chip lottery yada yada. :P
Usually AMD and Intel give you more voltages than is actually needed in order to have the largest possible amount of chips for each bin.
However... As you become more stringent with the Voltages/TDP/Frequency testing in order to have higher binned chips... Then your testing costs and time also increases.
Majority of APU's can hit this frequency without much of a problem though, in-fact most can surpass it, but you also have the GPU to consider, varying models have differing amounts of GPU hardware.
But with that said... These chips aren't going to be beating a heavily overclocked Phenom 2 x4 from 7 years ago, at 4.0 - 4.2ghz with a 3ghz NB clock the Phenom's would have the edge, at-least in terms of performance anyway. I would rather get a 95w Thuban hex and drop in a cheap discreet radeon than one of these APU's, would be cheaper and faster, but that's just me. :p
It's not as fast as Intel's best, but that's not the same thing as saying it's "slow". It's crazy fast by any other standards, and better than what more people are actually running.
While less exciting than the new micro-architectures, I hope the consideration of M.2 and USB3.1 will mean that the Ridge series will include these in the next North/South-bridge/FCH.
This product makes very little sense in lieu of upcoming Excavator based APUs for AM4 on same 28 nm process (due in 2016) and Zen based 14 nm ones (due in 2017). Those who already own a FM2+ APU won't get much of an upgrade over existing chips and those looking for a new features would be better off moving to AM4 because of its faster memory interface (which is crucial for APUs).
I see what you mean, and mostly agree, but for people who want to build or upgrade an FM2+ system right now, it seems like a consideration. That said, for new system builders who are willing to wait, AM4 + Excavator seems like the way to go.
Although I will admit that this product still seems pretty niche.
The most interesting stuff about FM2+ are the two Carrizo based Athlons, Athlon X4 835 and Athlon X4 845. If AMD could also bring Carrizo APUs on the FM2+ platform, then those boards could be interesting. If GCN 1.2 (or maybe I should start calling it 3.0) CAN'T be used on FM2+ boards, then those new boards in fact offer nothing. Better to go directly to AM4 even if this means selling 16 or more GBs of DDR3 memory and spending extra money for new DDR4.
As for the Am3+, if AMD doesn't produce processors with Excavator cores, it will just remain a zombie platform.
Pity they killed AM1. Bemma on that platform with 2.5-3.0GHz speeds could really offer much more than those pathetic one module APUs on FM2+, that I wouldn't use even if they where offered to me as a gift.
Problem with the AM3+ platform is that... They need to do more than just update the CPU line.
The IGP's could do with an upgrade, the Radeon 3200/4200 IGP's that some motherboards are still bundled with are no longer supported by AMD. (I.E. 700/800 series chipsets, some 900 series chipsets are merely rebadged 700/800 chipsets.)
Upgrading them to GCN with a more modern video engine would be fantastic. - Perhaps a return of Sideport memory?
Converesly... AM3 lacks all the modern stuff, natively like USB 3.0, 3.1, Type-C, Sata 3.1 and 3.2, PCI-E 3.0 etc'. They all use secondary chips which drives up costs and can be inefficient.
AM3+ has been a dead platform since Bulldozer flopped and AMD shifted focus to APU's.
The good part about it though is it's backwards compatability, motherboard died in that old Athlon 2 x4 box? Just swap the motherboard over with a newie.
"The AMD A-series (FM2+) processors support PCIe 3.0 x16 and hence can support an M.2 port with PCIe 3.0 x4 bandwidth, but in that case graphics cards will have to work in PCIe 3.0 x8 mode"
Hold your horses right there!
I'm fairly sure that kaveri/goavari APU's have 24 lanes of PCIe 3.0 on the chip....?
A little googling seem to indicate they have a GFX group with 2x8 lanes and a GPP group with UMI to chipset and 5 lanes for "general purpose ports". Only the 16 lanes in the GFX group support PCIe 3.0, the rest are limited to PCIe 2.0.
Well googled. Ta. But on a dual gpu slot like my fm2+ mobo, that still means u have a pcie 3 x4 slot for m.2 if you use 8 lane gpu, or 2 such slots if u use the IGP (as one would) .
"The new APU and motherboards will help AMD to maintain its competitive positions."
Now that is some grade-A comedy right there. Further, one has to wonder why AMD is bothering to band-aid features onto old platforms that should be dying out with the advent of Zen... unless, of course, AMD knows something about Zen that they aren't telling consumers.
AMD should refocus their current efforts on things that Zen isn't going to be involved in like the low-TDP or mobile side of things...Still waiting for Mullins to gain some traction. Continuing to spend money on weak desktop refreshes will dilute Zen. This is just reinforcing the rumors that Zen is badly behind schedule with Zen.
8320E for $100 plus UD3P board from Microcenter ($50 with CPU bundle pricing) = 4.3 - 4.5 GHz for very little. If you don't need fancy USB 3.1 and M.2 ports, or dual GPUs, it can still be a good enough value. Use the savings (even with the cost of a CPU cooler) to put more into the GPU. An FX at 4.3 - 4.5 is fine for a lot of workloads. $150 is rather inexpensive for a CPU and board and can be a budget Blender platform, and such. Another option is to use it at stock and make it a server.
Do note that Tech Report's benchmarks in at least one article with an overclocked 8320E appear to be very bottlenecked because APM doesn't look like it was disabled. That throttles the CPU down to 95 watts. It uses around 86 watts at stock.
Please correct me if I'm wrong but as of now, there isn't a single Mini-ITX FM2+ board with a DisplayPort. Is that not absolutely insane? That means zero options for UHD at 60Hz. That severely limits Kaveri's appeal for HTPC use.
I know you're trying to be helpful so thank you, but I was speaking specifically about HTPC use. I'm sure we can all agree that no discussion involving Kaveri and 60Hz UHD pertains to gaming =P
Does it support HDMI 2.0? That's a possible out. BTW, how's the AMD platform for UHD? Do you think AMD will bring hardware HEVC decode/encode to the hardware?
That is why this release makes no sense. A perfect platform for mini-ITX, HDMI 2.0, and M.2. I would've bought one if there were some good mini-ITX FM2+ mobo.
'Kaveri', the sound of that line still makes me vomit in my mouth; from when I bought the processor 2 years ago. Needless to say less than two months later I bought a 4770k a few months prior to 4790k release knowing of it as well.
Hmm. If they managed to get 4.1-4.3 GHz and a 900+ MHz core on the iGPU in the same 95W TDP, I kinda expect Bristol Ridge really awesome on desktop right now.
5-15% IPC improvement and hopefully same frequencies + GCN 1.2 at same 900+ MHz and using DDR4? Should make some significant improvements to overall performance.
The platforms are, in my view, partially to support the now $499 R9 Fury Nano. In all honesty, the Nano shines most in small form factor mini-ITX builds that drop the space need for 2.5" drives and full length GPUs. You can take a 95w or lower CPU, drop in the Fury and a Samsung 950 or similar NVMe drive and have an incredibly small gaming build. The caveat? Most Mini-ITX gaming cases have support for full length GPUs and 2.5" drives, which adds unnecessary space, and smaller cases run without room for at least an SFX power supply in the assumption that the build is eschewing a GPU altogether and all the builder needs is a picoPSU type setup. Even if you could find an appropriate case, AMD doesn't make and mini-ITX boards with M.2 ports. So if you wanted to use the Fury Nano as I suggested, Intel is really the only way to go. It does seems strange that AMD release the Nano for a very specific scenario, without providing a appropriate platform for it themselves. These moves seem aimed to rectify that.
Instructions Per Joule - IPJ is what matters the most.
If it can provide a 40% increase in IPC at the same stock clocks and a 20% reduced power consumption (not much wishful, easily attainable) then we have IPJ increased by 75%.
IPJ = IPC * f / P,
P can be reduced by undervolting thereby further increasing the IPJ.
Qualitatively, IPJ is nothing but IPS (Instructions Per Second) per Watt.
I think by this Announcement AMD can generate more revenue till end of this Quarter. I am also using the existing version of AMD for my company PCs and Laptops. I am associated with a Healthcare company which has more than 50 branches.
Yeay well, if i had to run a network of scores of very capable multimedia pcS, i think these would be as headache free and minimal TCO as possible. One main board does it all.
take out gaming, and they do most all else fine, a lot better than most laptops, which most use mainly anyhoo.
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KatherineShort - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
The company has also just revealed the A10-7890K APU, which offers a small speed increase over the current flagship APU from AMD, the A10-7870K.http://aimsely.com
ddriver - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
Too bad in AMD's case all references to "faster" outta be revisited to "less slow"nathanddrews - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
Can't these all be overclocked to about the same freq anyway?Alexvrb - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
Depends. The binning process often makes it more likely to get better results out of a chip that is clocked higher from the factory while sticking to the same voltage/TDP. Though market demand doesn't always match bin results and that's part why that doesn't always hold true. Long story short yes and no, chip lottery yada yada. :PStevoLincolnite - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
Usually AMD and Intel give you more voltages than is actually needed in order to have the largest possible amount of chips for each bin.However... As you become more stringent with the Voltages/TDP/Frequency testing in order to have higher binned chips... Then your testing costs and time also increases.
Majority of APU's can hit this frequency without much of a problem though, in-fact most can surpass it, but you also have the GPU to consider, varying models have differing amounts of GPU hardware.
But with that said... These chips aren't going to be beating a heavily overclocked Phenom 2 x4 from 7 years ago, at 4.0 - 4.2ghz with a 3ghz NB clock the Phenom's would have the edge, at-least in terms of performance anyway.
I would rather get a 95w Thuban hex and drop in a cheap discreet radeon than one of these APU's, would be cheaper and faster, but that's just me. :p
extide - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
These could be the result of an improved process, or perhaps even a slightly revised chip. So, there might be a bit more headroom in these chips.Wolfpup - Friday, January 15, 2016 - link
It's not as fast as Intel's best, but that's not the same thing as saying it's "slow". It's crazy fast by any other standards, and better than what more people are actually running.rocketscience315 - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
While less exciting than the new micro-architectures, I hope the consideration of M.2 and USB3.1 will mean that the Ridge series will include these in the next North/South-bridge/FCH.Arnulf - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
I don't want higher core voltage!??This product makes very little sense in lieu of upcoming Excavator based APUs for AM4 on same 28 nm process (due in 2016) and Zen based 14 nm ones (due in 2017). Those who already own a FM2+ APU won't get much of an upgrade over existing chips and those looking for a new features would be better off moving to AM4 because of its faster memory interface (which is crucial for APUs).
zodiacfml - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
It makes sense in a way it is a stopgap for 2017 products which should be released this year.AS118 - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
I see what you mean, and mostly agree, but for people who want to build or upgrade an FM2+ system right now, it seems like a consideration. That said, for new system builders who are willing to wait, AM4 + Excavator seems like the way to go.Although I will admit that this product still seems pretty niche.
Zefeh - Sunday, January 10, 2016 - link
Just a FYI, Zen is coming out this year - around 2Q-3Q.Namisecond - Saturday, March 12, 2016 - link
Those roadmaps are over a year out of date...yannigr2 - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
The latest GA-990FX-Gaming (rev. 1.0) offers M.2 and Type USB 3.1. By latest this card is already known from the mid December.http://www.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx...
The most interesting stuff about FM2+ are the two Carrizo based Athlons, Athlon X4 835 and Athlon X4 845. If AMD could also bring Carrizo APUs on the FM2+ platform, then those boards could be interesting. If GCN 1.2 (or maybe I should start calling it 3.0) CAN'T be used on FM2+ boards, then those new boards in fact offer nothing. Better to go directly to AM4 even if this means selling 16 or more GBs of DDR3 memory and spending extra money for new DDR4.
As for the Am3+, if AMD doesn't produce processors with Excavator cores, it will just remain a zombie platform.
Pity they killed AM1. Bemma on that platform with 2.5-3.0GHz speeds could really offer much more than those pathetic one module APUs on FM2+, that I wouldn't use even if they where offered to me as a gift.
yannigr2 - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
correction: Type C USB 3.1StevoLincolnite - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
Problem with the AM3+ platform is that...They need to do more than just update the CPU line.
The IGP's could do with an upgrade, the Radeon 3200/4200 IGP's that some motherboards are still bundled with are no longer supported by AMD. (I.E. 700/800 series chipsets, some 900 series chipsets are merely rebadged 700/800 chipsets.)
Upgrading them to GCN with a more modern video engine would be fantastic. - Perhaps a return of Sideport memory?
Converesly... AM3 lacks all the modern stuff, natively like USB 3.0, 3.1, Type-C, Sata 3.1 and 3.2, PCI-E 3.0 etc'.
They all use secondary chips which drives up costs and can be inefficient.
AM3+ has been a dead platform since Bulldozer flopped and AMD shifted focus to APU's.
The good part about it though is it's backwards compatability, motherboard died in that old Athlon 2 x4 box? Just swap the motherboard over with a newie.
Dirk Broer - Wednesday, January 13, 2016 - link
AM1 does not use modules. An <a href="http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Jaguar/AMD-Athlon%20... 5350</a> has four discrete Jaguar cores.R3MF - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
"The AMD A-series (FM2+) processors support PCIe 3.0 x16 and hence can support an M.2 port with PCIe 3.0 x4 bandwidth, but in that case graphics cards will have to work in PCIe 3.0 x8 mode"Hold your horses right there!
I'm fairly sure that kaveri/goavari APU's have 24 lanes of PCIe 3.0 on the chip....?
Kjella - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
A little googling seem to indicate they have a GFX group with 2x8 lanes and a GPP group with UMI to chipset and 5 lanes for "general purpose ports". Only the 16 lanes in the GFX group support PCIe 3.0, the rest are limited to PCIe 2.0.msroadkill612 - Thursday, October 24, 2019 - link
Well googled. Ta. But on a dual gpu slot like my fm2+ mobo, that still means u have a pcie 3 x4 slot for m.2 if you use 8 lane gpu, or 2 such slots if u use the IGP (as one would) .The_Assimilator - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
"The new APU and motherboards will help AMD to maintain its competitive positions."Now that is some grade-A comedy right there. Further, one has to wonder why AMD is bothering to band-aid features onto old platforms that should be dying out with the advent of Zen... unless, of course, AMD knows something about Zen that they aren't telling consumers.
fanofanand - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
You are suggesting AMD stop releasing updated products until they release Zen?nandnandnand - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
Full speed ahead on ZenNamisecond - Saturday, March 12, 2016 - link
AMD should refocus their current efforts on things that Zen isn't going to be involved in like the low-TDP or mobile side of things...Still waiting for Mullins to gain some traction. Continuing to spend money on weak desktop refreshes will dilute Zen. This is just reinforcing the rumors that Zen is badly behind schedule with Zen.Pissedoffyouth - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
as a massive AMD fanboy why the hell would you buy a AM3 mobo in 2016?Oxford Guy - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
8320E for $100 plus UD3P board from Microcenter ($50 with CPU bundle pricing) = 4.3 - 4.5 GHz for very little. If you don't need fancy USB 3.1 and M.2 ports, or dual GPUs, it can still be a good enough value. Use the savings (even with the cost of a CPU cooler) to put more into the GPU. An FX at 4.3 - 4.5 is fine for a lot of workloads. $150 is rather inexpensive for a CPU and board and can be a budget Blender platform, and such. Another option is to use it at stock and make it a server.Oxford Guy - Saturday, January 9, 2016 - link
Do note that Tech Report's benchmarks in at least one article with an overclocked 8320E appear to be very bottlenecked because APM doesn't look like it was disabled. That throttles the CPU down to 95 watts. It uses around 86 watts at stock.Namisecond - Saturday, March 12, 2016 - link
Shouldn't you be waiting on AM4 and Zen in the latter half of the year rather than putting money in another round of the AM3 platform?Namisecond - Saturday, March 12, 2016 - link
The operative word here is "fanboy"Assimilator87 - Sunday, January 10, 2016 - link
Please correct me if I'm wrong but as of now, there isn't a single Mini-ITX FM2+ board with a DisplayPort. Is that not absolutely insane? That means zero options for UHD at 60Hz. That severely limits Kaveri's appeal for HTPC use.stephenbrooks - Sunday, January 10, 2016 - link
I've never heard of them advertising APUs as being a good thing to drive a 4K60 display. They'll tell you the discrete R9 390X or similar is for that.Assimilator87 - Sunday, January 10, 2016 - link
I know you're trying to be helpful so thank you, but I was speaking specifically about HTPC use. I'm sure we can all agree that no discussion involving Kaveri and 60Hz UHD pertains to gaming =PNamisecond - Saturday, March 12, 2016 - link
Does it support HDMI 2.0? That's a possible out. BTW, how's the AMD platform for UHD? Do you think AMD will bring hardware HEVC decode/encode to the hardware?nos024 - Tuesday, January 12, 2016 - link
That is why this release makes no sense. A perfect platform for mini-ITX, HDMI 2.0, and M.2. I would've bought one if there were some good mini-ITX FM2+ mobo.Stragak - Sunday, January 10, 2016 - link
'Kaveri', the sound of that line still makes me vomit in my mouth; from when I bought the processor 2 years ago. Needless to say less than two months later I bought a 4770k a few months prior to 4790k release knowing of it as well.Squinoogle - Sunday, January 10, 2016 - link
That slide seems to suggest that the M.2 will only support SATA so the whole discussion about PCIe lanes seems moot.Cryio - Thursday, January 14, 2016 - link
Hmm. If they managed to get 4.1-4.3 GHz and a 900+ MHz core on the iGPU in the same 95W TDP, I kinda expect Bristol Ridge really awesome on desktop right now.5-15% IPC improvement and hopefully same frequencies + GCN 1.2 at same 900+ MHz and using DDR4? Should make some significant improvements to overall performance.
About time after 2.5 years.
ajlueke - Thursday, January 14, 2016 - link
The platforms are, in my view, partially to support the now $499 R9 Fury Nano. In all honesty, the Nano shines most in small form factor mini-ITX builds that drop the space need for 2.5" drives and full length GPUs. You can take a 95w or lower CPU, drop in the Fury and a Samsung 950 or similar NVMe drive and have an incredibly small gaming build.The caveat? Most Mini-ITX gaming cases have support for full length GPUs and 2.5" drives, which adds unnecessary space, and smaller cases run without room for at least an SFX power supply in the assumption that the build is eschewing a GPU altogether and all the builder needs is a picoPSU type setup. Even if you could find an appropriate case, AMD doesn't make and mini-ITX boards with M.2 ports. So if you wanted to use the Fury Nano as I suggested, Intel is really the only way to go. It does seems strange that AMD release the Nano for a very specific scenario, without providing a appropriate platform for it themselves. These moves seem aimed to rectify that.
imran27 - Tuesday, March 15, 2016 - link
Instructions Per Joule - IPJ is what matters the most.If it can provide a 40% increase in IPC at the same stock clocks and a 20% reduced power consumption (not much wishful, easily attainable) then we have IPJ increased by 75%.
IPJ = IPC * f / P,
P can be reduced by undervolting thereby further increasing the IPJ.
Qualitatively, IPJ is nothing but IPS (Instructions Per Second) per Watt.
cara smith - Friday, May 6, 2016 - link
I think by this Announcement AMD can generate more revenue till end of this Quarter. I am also using the existing version of AMD for my company PCs and Laptops. I am associated with a Healthcare company which has more than 50 branches.riandamimi - Thursday, June 16, 2016 - link
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Yeay well, if i had to run a network of scores of very capable multimedia pcS, i think these would be as headache free and minimal TCO as possible. One main board does it all.take out gaming, and they do most all else fine, a lot better than most laptops, which most use mainly anyhoo.
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